Grey Knights - Playtestan' @ 1500

One game with and two games against the new GKs in two days; a win, a draw, and a loss.  I think I'm starting to get my head around what works and what doesn't.  Some musings, but first an apology to Mat Ward.  I came into this book thinking it looked like shit.  It's not shit.  It's awesome.  So, sorry about that.

Now, musings:

= In terms of how it all works, in my mind the GKs seem to be a lot like the Wolves, however where the Wolves rely on chipping away at you and find resiliency in having multiples of everything, the GKs will out-and-out kill your face off and find resiliency in the fact they are Marines-Plus.  Squad for squad they are surprisingly destructive, and while a lot of their smashiness is concentrated in a 24 inch bubble they do have access to some natty fire support too.
= Psyfleman Dreads are, I reckon, the GK's Long Fangs; they're really, really good.  Four S8 shots with rerolls to hit is enough to push a damage result past any transport's cover save in the early game, and once the cover saves start disappearing it's easily enough to tear most light vehicles to bits.
= Fortitude allows you to be a little more cavalier about deploying and moving your vehicles, and it can make GK mech armies a right royal pain in the bum.  How?  All the Autocannons and Missile Launchers you have brought along to Stunlock transports and Walkers; Fortitude makes those not work.  Either you kill the vehicle, or it will keep coming after you.
= After yesterday's game against an MSU Coteaz army I was thinking Fortitude might be a good excuse to bring Land Raiders, the rationale being that silly Glancing hits from Missile Launchers and Lascannons would not be an issue.  I was wrong.  In most armies that can use them you will have enough models on the table to prevent Deep Striking Land Speeders and suicide Rhinos from Meltagunning them to death; not so with the Grey Knights.  Mine only survived because my opponent's Land Speeder gunners were drunk, and his Meltawagons were too busy trying to stop my Dreads from chewing through his army.
= Dreadknights... they're a riot.  They're almost worth taking for the Heavy Incinerator alone, which I reckon will be what most people do since his other shooting options don't seem all that inspiring.  The Greatsword definitely seems worth it's water, although it's a choice between +1 Attack for free (giving him 5 on the charge) and rerolls on... well, everything it's possible to reroll in close combat for an extra 25pts.
= Psycannons are really cool.  They're not as spammable as I'd like, but you can choke in enough of them at 1500pts to give most people headaches and they are dangerous enough to armour that they can't be ignored.  The fact they will do a number on infantry doesn't really need to be stated; combined with Storm Bolters and Hammerhanded power weapons your anti-infantry needs are more or less taken care of.  Give them to Terminators and they're very nasty indeed; Grand Masters and BroCaps pay a shit-ton of points for them for a reason.
= All that said, while your basic GK can and will step on the throat of most any other trooper you throw him at, the real anti-infantry nastiness lies with Purifiers.  Cleansing Flame, cheap Halberds and free Incinerators sort of mark them out as the blokes you push into Ork hordes, although the extra Psycannons they have access to come in handy too.
= Grand Masters are awesome now.  Other HQ options are available, some of them just as awesome, but if you want a big GK army at 1500pts then you're either taking a Grand Master or you're taking Crowe, as far as I can see.

I've got a couple more games booked in over the weekend so that gives me a chance to see how this all bears out. Guard and Tyranids next; yay!

Nate Dogg have die

But we will remember him always.

1500pt Grey Knights crap

Posted this over at H-O, postan' it here too.  Barring some mathematical failure I think they should work okay:

Grey Knights 1500
HQ
Mordrak
Coteaz

Elites
Purifier Squad
- 5 bods, 3 Halberds, 1 Incinerator, 1 Hammer, Rhino
Purifier Squad
- 5 bods, 3 Halberds, 1 Incinerator, 1 Hammer, Rhino

Troops
Terminators
- 5 bods, 3 Halberds, 1 Sword, Psycannon, Justicar w/ Hammer
Henchman Warband
- 2x Jokaero, 2x Crusader, Las/ Plas Razorback
Henchman Warband
- 2x Jokaero, 2x Crusader, Las/ Plas Razorback

Heavy Support
Psyfleman Dread
- 2x TL Autocannons, Psybolt Ammunition
Psyfleman Dread
- 2x TL Autocannons, Psybolt Ammunition

Backfield consists of 2 Dreads, the Monkey Bulters and their Razorbacks, and Coteaz. Purifiers, Mordrak and the Terminators go forwards. Purifiers are to hoover up hordes and infantry, everything else is sort of self-explanatory. Use Mordrak's super-powers to make as many units Scoring as possible; prefer the Purifiers if you have to chase objectives and the Dreads if you have to hold ones you're sitting on. Coteaz can sit in a Monkey Bulter squad and use Sanctuary to stop people charging them, or he can mongle forward with the Terminators if you're not Deep Striking them. Shove Mordrak in people's faces so they shoot him and he spawns Knights.

Coteazwing 1500
HQ
Coteaz
Croweballs

Troops
Purifier Squad
- 10 bods, 2 Halberds, 1 Sword, 1 Incinerator, 1 Hammer, 3 Psycannons, Rhino
Purifier Squad
- 10 bods, 2 Halberds, 1 Sword, 1 Incinerator, 1 Hammer, 3 Psycannons, Rhino
Henchman Warband
- 2x Jokaero, 1x HB Servitor, 2x Warrior w/ Boltgun, Las/ Plas Razorback
Henchman Warband
- 2x Jokaero, 1x HB Servitor, 2x Warrior w/ Boltgun, Las/ Plas Razorback

Heavy Support
Psyfleman Dread
- 2x TL Autocannons, Psybolt Ammunition
Psyfleman Dread
- 2x TL Autocannons, Psybolt Ammunition

Same as the last one more or less, except here you have Purifiers who'll want to Combat Squad; close combat gear and the Incinerator go into the Rhinos, 3 Psycannons walk around on their own. Use Coteaz and Crowe together; Sanctuary, and the threat of being charged by a loony with Rends-on 4+ attacks who will remove your Hive Tyrant from play if he dies in base contact, should provide a reasonable disincentive to launch assaults on your Psycannons.

The Warriors with Bolters are wound counters. They fail at being anything else.


Fuck You And Your Henchmen 1500
HQ
Grand Master w/ 3x Servo Skulls & Incinerator
Librarian w/ Halberd, The Shrouding, The Summoning & Teleport Homer

Elites
Purifier Squad
- 5 bods, 2 Psycannons, TL-AssCan Razorback w/ Psybolt Ammunition
Purifier Squad
- 5 bods, 2 Psycannons, TL-AssCan Razorback w/ Psybolt Ammunition

Troops
Terminators
- 5 bods, 4 Halberds, Incinerator, Justicar w/ Mastercrafted Hammer
Strike Squad
- 5 bods, Psilencer, TL-AssCan Razorback w/ Psybolt Ammunition

Heavy Support
Psyfleman Dread
- 2x TL Autocannons, Psybolt Ammunition & Warp Stabilisation Field
Psyfleman Dread
- 2x TL Autocannons, Psybolt Ammunition & Warp Stabilisation Field

More or less the same dealie as the Mordrak list, except instead of Monkey Lascannons you have S7 Rending all over the place and a Librarian to do Flying Circus-style tricks.

You may want to drop the Warp Stabilisers off the Dreads and stick them on the Purifiers' Razorbacks instead that might be an idea, although with everything either riding forward or Deep Striking in having the Dreads sitting in the backfield on their own might be a problem.

The Servo-Skulls are to keep landing zones clear for the DSing Termies, while the Strike Squad has a Psilencer because they are free and pretty neat, despite looking like a Pie Gun from Bugsy Malone.

Stelek's 6+6: Chaos Spess Mehriens 1500pts

From this:
http://yesthetruthhurts.com/2011/02/chaos-using-the-66-and-the-42/

To this:

Chaos Space Marines 6+6: 1500pts
HQ - 105
Lord w/ Power Weapon - 105

Elites - 210
Dread w/ TLAC & ML - 110
Dread w/ CCW & ML - 100

Troops - 685
Chaos Marines - 145
- 4 bods, 1x Champion w/ Combi-Melta, 1x Meltagun, Rhino
Chaos Marines - 145
- 4 bods, 1x Champion w/ Combi-Melta, 1x Meltagun, Rhino
Chaos Marines - 145
- 4 bods, 1x Champion w/ Combi-Melta, 1x Meltagun, Rhino
Noise Marines - 125
- 5x Pervs w/ Sonic Blasters
Noise Marines - 125
- 5x Pervs w/ Sonic Blasters

Fast Attack - 240
Raptors - 120
- 5 bods, 2x Meltagun
Raptors - 120
- 5 bods, 2x Meltagun

Heavy Support - 260
Autolas Pred - 130
Autolas Pred - 130


Is it still 6+6?

Anti-tank:
2 Preds
2 Raptors
1 Dread

Anti-infantry:
2 Noise Marines1 Dread

Plus the CSMs, who can RF at stuff or Melta things.

I would've preferred to have kept the Greater Daemon - or at the very least got a flying DP to replace him - but couldn't make it fit in a way that appealed to me.


Runs much the same way as Stelek's, in case you're wondering, however the loss of the Vindicator means you haven't really got a big fat 'Shoot Me Plz!' vehicle to put in midfield.  Your choices are either make do and mend, or alternatively ditch a CSM death-ride and bring the Vindicator.

My Wolves - Last Time

HQ - 320
Rune Priest w/ Stormcaller, Living Lightning
Wolf Lord w/ TW Mount, Frost Blade, Storm Shield, 2x Wolves

Elites - 200
Wolf Guard
- 3x PAWG w/ combi-melta
- 1x TAWG w/ Chainfist & Storm Shield
- 1x TAWG w/ CML, Storm Bolter & Wolf Claw

Troops - 660
3 of:
Grey Hunters
- 5 bods, Meltagun. Rhino
Grey Hunters
- 5 bods, Meltagun, Las/ Plas RB
Grey Hunters
- 5 bods, Plasma Gun, Las/ Plas RB

Fast Attack - 40
Fenrisian Wolves
- 5x Wolf

Heavy Support - 280
2 of:
Long Fangs
- 2x ML, Las/ Plas RB

Motherf--

Finding out Matt Ward is writing the GK Codex has put a right old damper on my passion to re-do my GKs; given his efforts thus far in 5th I have difficulty believing the book will be about anything other than selling DreadKnight kits (which, by the way, look like fucking Optimus Prime), that the army will be anything other than bland and soulless, or that he will be able to resist the desire to make GKs an Ultramarines successor Chapter and retcon the Inquisition so it was invented by some Sergeant from the Third Company.  Or maybe Rowboat himself.

So bollocks to it, it's Dark Eldar time!

I haven't really digested the Codex yet but as near as I can tell it is yet more Phil Kelly filth in much the same style as the Space Wolves book; lots of bodies, lots of guns, lots of options, however where the Wolves can spread the hate throughout the entire army the Sexy Elves seem to be more about specialisation, and avoiding damage altogether rather than soaking it in stoic, mean-bastard Space Viking style.

I'mma get on that now.  Lists... soon.

Preparing For GK Codex Stage 2

Here you see approximately 1100 points of my 1500pt pure Grey Knight army, stripped and ready for repainting.

I'm guessing GKs in power armour will be Elites or Nemesis Force Weapons will cost 30pts per model in the new book.  Otherwise I would be able to use my old models to make a new army, and Jervis won't allow that (cf. Blood Angels Death Company).

Preparing For GK Codex Stage 1

Betazone; kills all known 8 year old paintjobs dead.  Also looks like piss and smells like a hospital, hence the butty box with airtight lid.

Enjoy your bath, Justicar Failbot!

lol

There's already a drum-beating gorilla, all the Proddy Boys need now is a flute-playing lion and the Fenians will be completely fucked.

Space Wolves - The DogStar 1500pts

Just some stupid rubbish.  It is very bad, but if you're one of those goons who insists that TWC can only work with Storm Shields you might get a kick out of it:

HQ - 335
Wolf Lord - 235
- TW Mount, Storm Shield, Frost Blade, SotWarrior Born
Rune Priest w/ powers or whatever - 100

Troops - 450
Grey Hunters - 150
- 5 bods, Flamer, Las/ Plas RB
Grey Hunters - 150
- 5 bods, Flamer, Las/ Plas RB
Grey Hunters - 150
- 5 bods, Flamer, Las/ Plas RB
Grey Hunters - 150
- 5 bods, Flamer, Las/ Plas RB

Fast Attack - 360
TWC - 360
- 4 bods, 4 Storm shields, 1x Thunder Hammer, 1x Meltabombs, 1x Mark

Heavy Support - 195
Long Fangs - 65
- 2x ML
Long Fangs - 65
- 2x ML
Long Fangs - 65
- 2x ML


Alternatively drop a TWC model and plough more points into the Lord.  Or drop two and bring a WGBL.

Any way you slice it it's a fail list, but it has a big Cavalry Deathstar.  So... y'know.  Lol.

My Wolves - A Rejig

HQ - 320
Rune Priest w/ Tempest's Wrath, Living Lightning
Wolf Lord w/ TW Mount, Frost Blade, Storm Shield, 2x Wolves

Elites - 215
Wolf Guard
- 3x PAWG w/ combi-melta
- 1x TAWG w/ Chainfist & Storm Shield
- 1x TAWG w/ CML, Storm Shield & Wolf Claw

Troops - 685
3 of:
Grey Hunters - 115
- 5 bods, Meltagun. Rhino
2 of:
Grey Hunters - 160
- 5 bods, Plasma Gun, Las/ Plas RB

Fast Attack - 105
TWC x1 w/ PFist & SS

Heavy Support - 195
3 of:
Long Fangs
- 2x ML

It breaks down like this:
- Wolf Lord & the TWC dude
- Rune Priest and the Chainfist in one of the 5-man GH footsloggers
- Cyclone WG with the other 5-man GH footsloggers
- Two Razorbacks
- Three combi-Melta WG with the three Meltas-In-A-Box GH packs
- Three Long Fangs packs

The basic idea is this; I have 5 vehicles and lots of bodies.  40 to be exact, plus the little Cavalry unit, which is basically a Monstrous Creature that will come and get you if you don't deploy properly.  And even if you do.

It still needs tweaks but I think it fits better into the Space Wolves themes of flexibility and 'fucking shit everywhere goddamn' than the last list did.

Also hidden Chainfist lol.

Blood Angels - 1500pts

BA 1500pts  [1]
HQ - 140
Librarian w/ Infernus, Sword & Shield

Elites - 270
Sternguard Squad
- 5 bods, 2x ML
Sternguard Squad
- 5 bods, 2x ML

Troops - 610
Assault Squad
- 10 bods, 2x Meltagun & PFist
Assault Squad
- 10 bods, 2x Meltagun & PFist
Assault Squad
- 5 bods, Meltagun, Infernus & Lightning Claw

Fast Attack - 220
Bike Squad - 110
- 3 bods, 2x Meltagun
Bike Squad - 110
- 3 bods, 2x Meltagun

Heavy Support - 260
Devastator Squad
- 4x ML
Devastator Squad
- 4x ML



BA 1500pts  [2]
HQ - 125
Librarian w/ JP, Sword & Shield

Elites - 270
Sternguard Squad
- 5 bods, 2x ML
Sternguard Squad
- 5 bods, 2x ML

Troops - 845
Assault Squad
- 10 bods, 2x Meltagun & PFist
Assault Squad
- 10 bods, 2x Meltagun & PFist
Assault Squad
- 10 bods, 2x Meltagun & PFist
Assault Squad
- 5 bods, Meltagun, Infernus & Lightning Claw

Heavy Support - 260
Devastator Squad
- 4x ML
Devastator Squad
- 4x ML



BA 1500pts  [3]
HQ - 125
Librarian w/ JP, Sword & Shield

Elites - 270
Sternguard Squad
- 5 bods, 2x ML
Sternguard Squad
- 5 bods, 2x ML

Troops - 810
Assault Squad
- 10 bods, 2x Meltagun & PFist
Assault Squad
- 10 bods, 2x Meltagun & PFist
Assault Squad
- 5 bods, Meltagun, Infernus & Lightning Claw
Scout Squad
- 5 bods, ML, 4x Sniper Rifles, Camo Cloaks
Scout Squad
- 5 bods, ML, 4x Sniper Rifles, Camo Cloaks


Heavy Support - 260
Devastator Squad
- 4x ML
Devastator Squad
- 4x ML


More or less the same cake thrice, just different icing.

50+ MEQ bodies plus 12 Missiles plus Meltaguns plus Jump Packs plus a Librarian.  Maybe scary, maybe not.  I like them though.

Daemonhunters - 1500pts

List dump #3: Wherein we prove that even the best DH list is a complete crock of arse and the Ordo Malleus picked the wrong Chamber Militant.

HQ - 155
Inquisitor Lord Retinue -155
- Nekkid Lord Of Failure
- 3 Veteran Guardsmen, 3 Meltaguns, 1 Rhino

Elites - 220
Inquisitor Retinue - 110
- Inquisiturd
- 2 Veteran Guardsmen, 2 Meltaguns, Rhino
Inquisitor Retinue - 110
- Inquisiturd
- 2 Veteran Guardsmen, 2 Meltaguns, Rhino

Troops - 580
IST Squad - 120
- 5 bods, 2 Meltaguns, 1 Rhino
IST Squad - 120

- 5 bods, 2 Meltaguns, 1 Rhino
GK Squad - 170
- Justicar + 4 bods, 2x Incinerator
GK Squad - 170
- Justicar + 4 bods, 2x Incinerator


Heavy Support - 500
GK Land Raider - 250
GK Land Raider - 250

1455pts.  Spend the other 45pts on WETF; I have stopped caring.


Back to the novels and RPGs with you, Ordo Malleus.


EDIT:  Apparently Codex: Grey Knights is due in April, which is a good thing.  I'm going to leave this poo-stain of an army list here for posterity; as you Johnny-Come-Latelies sit there in April fawning over the  ridiculous special characters and new Super Nemesis Force Bomber planes the Grey Knights get, look back upon this list and know what Daemonhunters players have been up against for the past 9 years.  It was a big brick wall of fail, and it was called the Grey Knights.

Sisters Immospam V2 (No Guard) - 1500pts

Stelek's WH-only Immo Spam list at 1500pts.

Same basic idea, lots of hulls and lots of flaming death; 6 dual-Melta squads, only 3 dual-Plasma squads but plenty of twin-linked Templates should see you alright, 4 scoring units, all of them in vehicles.  Of which there are 11.

Zero CC.  You don't need it because anything coming within 12-18" of the army will get fried.

Nekkid IST squad goes in one of the HS Immos - they don't need a fire point, y'see.

HQ - 185
1 Palatine, 185 pts
4 Celestian Retinue (Meltagun x2)
1 Sister Superior
1 Immolator (Twin Linked Heavy Flamer)

Elites - 450
4 Celestian Squad, 150 pts (Meltagun x2)
1 Sister Superior
1 Immolator (Twin Linked Heavy Flamer)
4 Celestian Squad, 150 pts (Meltagun x2)
1 Sister Superior
1 Immolator (Twin Linked Heavy Flamer)
4 Celestian Squad, 150 pts (Meltagun x2)
1 Sister Superior
1 Immolator (Twin Linked Heavy Flamer)

Troops - 410
5 Inquisitorial Stormtroopers, 120 pts (Plasmagun x2)
1 Rhino
5 Inquisitorial Stormtroopers, 120 pts (Plasmagun x2)
1 Rhino
5 Inquisitorial Stormtroopers, 120 pts (Plasmagun x2)
1 Rhino
5 Inquisitorial Stormtroopers, 50pts (No wargear)

Fast Attack - 300
4 Dominion Squad, 150 pts (Meltagun x2)
1 Sister Superior
1 Immolator (Twin Linked Heavy Flamer)
4 Dominion Squad, 150 pts (Meltagun x2)
1 Sister Superior
1 Immolator (Twin Linked Heavy Flamer)

Heavy Support - 130
1 Immolator, 65 pts (Twin Linked Heavy Flamer)
1 Immolator, 65 pts (Twin Linked Heavy Flamer)


Yes, I copy-paste-cropped it.


Shut up.

My Wolves - 1500pts

HQ - 365
Rune Priest w/ Tempest's Wrath, Living Lightning & Chooser
Wolf Lord w/ SotWarrior Born, Runic Armour, Frost Blade, Storm Shield & TW Mount

Elites - 130
Wolf Guard
- PAWG w/ combi-melta & Powerfist
- PAWG w/ combi-melta & Powerfist
- PAWG w/ combi-melta & Powerfist

Troops - 735
Grey Hunters Pack
- 5x GH, Meltagun, Power Weapon, MotW, Rhino
Grey Hunters Pack
- 5x GH, Meltagun, Power Weapon, MotW, Rhino
Grey Hunters Pack
- 5x GH, Meltagun, Power Weapon, MotW, Rhino
Grey Hunters Pack
- 5x GH, Flamer, Las/ Plas RB
Grey Hunters Pack
- 5x GH, Flamer, Las/ Plas RB

Fast Attack - 75
Fenrisian Wolves
- 9x Wolf

Heavy Support - 195
Long Fangs
- Leader, 2x ML
Long Fangs
- Leader, 2x ML
Long Fangs
- Leader, 2x ML